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Author
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Topic: ...my God, what has happened to this place?
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The Great Dreamer
Farting Nudist
Member # 117
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posted 01-10-2007 12:34 PM
Why aren't you guys playing Pokemon!?
What happened to the best pokemon lab ever!?
We will all be able to battle online in April, why aren't you doing anything about it!?
Blizzard's site is down, Pokemon Forver is down and all of the great people from the good ol' days of yonder!! What happened here!!!??
This breaks my heart.
C'mon, guys! Get up! Get up! Let's prepare for Pokemon Diamond & Pearl for the DS that will come out on April!! It will have online access via WiFi and we will be able to make our own personal networks and ban cheaters and hackers forever! This is the dawn of a new era, let the old poke-gods of yesteryear awaken their peaceful slumber!! Awaken, ancient lords of pokemon research and battle! Awaken, AZURE HEIGHTS!!! ![[PBJ Time!]](graemlins/pbjtime.gif)
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"Pokemon, no matter what anyone says, is not just about link battles. PBS is not Pokemon." -Mr. K
From: Las Vegas were everyone uses Mimic & Metronome! | Registered: Mar 2000
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Mewone
I have a pokemon as my username. I mean, come on.
Member # 1694
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posted 01-10-2007 03:26 PM
f u get out
From: Azure Heights | Registered: Apr 2001
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Rolken
Vulcan
Member # 7
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posted 01-10-2007 05:39 PM
I might get into DP again, solely because you don't have to grind to be a contender; it apparently sets everyone's stats to lv50.
Too bad it's still basically the same game we were playing 8 years ago.
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[insert sig here]
From: Provo, UT | Registered: Feb 2000
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FlameBait
Farting Nudist
Member # 235
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posted 01-10-2007 05:50 PM
quote:
Originally posted by Rolken:
I might get into DP again
[ 01-10-2007, 05:51 PM: Message edited by: FlameBait ]
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"The preceding post may have contained profanity, obscenity, racial slurs, and/or evidence of spamming. By reading this statement, you devoid the right to warn/ban the user based on the above post."
From: Nashville, TN, USA | Registered: Apr 2000
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Dragonite21
Farting Nudist
Member # 475
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posted 01-10-2007 06:13 PM
quote:
Originally posted by Rolken:
Too bad it's still basically the same game we were playing 8 years ago.
With like a million new monsters? Can't be bothered.
"Gotta catch 'em all! All 6051!"
From: London, United Kingdom | Registered: May 2000
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The Great Dreamer
Farting Nudist
Member # 117
Member Rated:
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posted 01-10-2007 06:53 PM
I supposed that what matters is how many of those million monsters are practical in the context of competition. I hope Nintendo does something more than abling us to create our own private network of players to balance the game further.
I just don't know why they can't just make a persistant server you can go to have matches and make all of the stats native to the host instead of clientside. Hey, with pokemon's 2-D graphics, they could easily make it happen.
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"Pokemon, no matter what anyone says, is not just about link battles. PBS is not Pokemon." -Mr. K
From: Las Vegas were everyone uses Mimic & Metronome! | Registered: Mar 2000
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Land und Leute
HETEROSEXUAL
Member # 1040
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posted 01-10-2007 06:56 PM
quote:
Originally posted by FlameBait:
quote:
Originally posted by Rolken:
I might get into DP again
You guys are so nasty. Grow up.
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theclaw: I can't rate myself!!
Registered: Oct 2000
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Rolken
Vulcan
Member # 7
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posted 01-11-2007 05:16 AM
Get off a pokemon forum, mr mature.
From: Provo, UT | Registered: Feb 2000
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Land und Leute
HETEROSEXUAL
Member # 1040
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posted 01-11-2007 06:45 AM
Clearly, you are missing the joke.
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theclaw: I can't rate myself!!
Registered: Oct 2000
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ieR2
Farting Nudist
Member # 3934
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posted 01-12-2007 09:58 AM
TGD? whao
Anyway: 
Is the new game wifi compatible? It never was fun spending months training lvl99 teams and never having anyone to play with. ![[Trash Koffing]](graemlins/trashkoffing.gif)
KG
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Itidiots.com
From: CA | Registered: Jul 2006
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JohtoMaster
Farting Nudist
Member # 1023
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posted 01-12-2007 10:08 AM
quote:
Originally posted by ieR2:
Is the new game wifi compatible?
Yes. Both trading and battling.
From: Valparaiso, IN, USA | Registered: Oct 2000
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Lark84
My skeleton is made of creamy nougat.
Member # 1186
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posted 01-12-2007 01:46 PM
Like Rolken says, it's basically the same game, unless they've changed it dramatically somehow. Shit like berries, contests, trendy phrase, secret bases and mixing records does not count, since it does very little to change the actual gaming experience.
I'm a sucker for stories revolving around exploration, or explorative gameplay. Pokémon Red had both, and thus really appealed to me, since you not only got to explore a huge world, you also got to catch 150 different Pokémon, most of which were totally unknown to you before you had seen or caught them.
Every time the screen went black, I'd wonder "What´s going to pop up now?", then I'd go "What's that? Better catch it!", and finally read through the Pokédex entry with great interest, delightfully immersing myself in the world lovingly created by Game Freak.
But that concept is old by now. Plus, 500 (or whatever the number is) Pokémon is just too much to keep track of. I don't have 7 hours of free time every day like I used to. I'm not saying that's a bad thing - I do a lot of fun stuff - but it just means I come from a different position now compared to 8 years ago in terms of how I value what's worth spending time on. And the next Pokémon game is not.
Registered: Nov 2000
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Fish
Farting Nudist
Member # 267
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posted 01-12-2007 05:54 PM
Well, yea, the RPG element has been done over and over again with little new features every generation. But I would think (most of) the people who came to Azure Heights were more interested in the competitive aspect.
I would say the competitive aspect of the game has changed dramatically from the RBY days. GSC brought on the splitting of special into special attack and special defense. Held items could be attached to have various effects on battles. ADV brought even more. By limiting the amount of stat experience you could get for a Pokémon, you had to choose which stats you wanted to put them into. Instead of maxing them all, you only had enough to entirely fill two, or spread them more thin between some or all of them. Natures let you tinker with your stats a little bit more to raise a selected stat over the previous maximum at the expense of losing points in another. And of course, there were a great deal more items and moves. The newest installment will feature even more items and moves and Pokémon of course, but I think the most interesting aspect of this game will be the splitting of types between special and physical attack stats. No longer are all normal attacks based off attack and all water based off special. For example, the physical normal-typed body slam will function off attack as it always has, however a more mystical hyper beam will function off special. Every attack type is broken up in this way.
I don't know why I wrote all that.
[ 01-12-2007, 05:57 PM: Message edited by: Fish ]
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Bullshit.
From: Phoenix, AZ | Registered: Apr 2000
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ieR2
Farting Nudist
Member # 3934
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posted 01-12-2007 06:05 PM
You know why you wrote it.
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Itidiots.com
From: CA | Registered: Jul 2006
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Rolken
Vulcan
Member # 7
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posted 01-12-2007 06:59 PM
quote:
Originally posted by Fish:
Well, yea, the RPG element has been done over and over again with little new features every generation. But I would think (most of) the people who came to Azure Heights were more interested in the competitive aspect.
I think most people started playing for the RPG element and then got hooked on the competition as a result. The problem is that Pokemon just isn't a very good competitive series. The games aren't developed with an emphasis on competitive balance, and so competitors end up trying to salvage a metagame that inevitably spirals down to the point where 10% of pokemon/abilities are actually useful and luck is a primary factor. Without a strong central game or a strong metagame, it's difficult for me to maintain interest.
I would venture that the only reasons Pokemon competition retains a moderate level of popularity is that competitive turn-based RPGs are an underserved genre and kiddies are attached to the series and/or don't know what other stuff is out there. Warcraft or Guild Wars or Magic are all much better games.
[ 01-12-2007, 07:00 PM: Message edited by: Rolken ]
From: Provo, UT | Registered: Feb 2000
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Lark84
My skeleton is made of creamy nougat.
Member # 1186
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posted 01-13-2007 06:46 AM
But in order to get a good team, you have to slog through the RPG side of the story (unless you shark), finding TM:s, catching Pokémon, training them etc.
When the RPG element is unappealing, I get less motivated to build a team. Training and boxing Pokémon to get them to L100 in Red was pretty boring, but since I already loved the game, I was willing to pay that price for the reward of extending the game's lifetime considerably (after beating Elite four, I could now battle people in real life, develop teams and strategies etc.).
So I guess I agree with Rolken again - without a strong central game, it's difficult for me to maintain interest.
Regarding Magic... I don't play Magic a lot, but the nature of Magic lets me quickly assemble a deck and play an oppponent with it[1]. The competitive element is the game's core. With Pokémon, I first have to jump through a huge hoop (the same RPG it's always been, just with a little more crap tacked on) before I can start battling people.
[1] Yes, I know you need to make a pretty big investment in cards before you can assemble anything that's actually useful in a tournament environment... But in casual play, you can proxy cards (analogous to sharking, I guess) or agree to only use sucky cards or play booster drafts or whatever. The analogy fails in some respects but I still think Rolken had a good point.
Registered: Nov 2000
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Rolken
Vulcan
Member # 7
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posted 01-13-2007 11:16 PM
For older folks, I'd bet the investment in cash for a Magic deck would be a lot more palatable than the investment in time to grind to lv100.
From: Provo, UT | Registered: Feb 2000
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Mr. K
Racist
Member # 2
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posted 01-14-2007 03:27 AM
Lark84: When the RPG element is unappealing, I get less motivated to build a team.
I've completely agree with that. As you said, the first time it was fun and training (while repetitive) was something of a badge of honor, allowing you to bond with your Pokemon in a way that's impossible with a playing card.
If Pokemon were only a battling game, I'd never have paid much attention to it. Initially I enjoyed the "Gotta catch 'em all!" aspect of it, and as a simple farming/bartering game with charismatic collectables, I would have been happy with it.
I might have played one or two PBS games to completion, despite spending hours dicking around with the code. Other than the mall tours, I had only a handful of real battles, unless you count playing the computer in Stadium.
Battling was just a fun extra to me. I have zero interest in any of those card games, although a lot of that has to do with the elfhumping nature of them.
The original Pokemon universe is really terrific source material which could be mined in so many interesting ways, but now that there are too many species with too many dongles to keep in your mind without making a career out of it, it's incredibly boring to me.
That and the show sucks now, so I don't even care about the source material, which was the original draw for me.
I think Pokemon Snap was the height of their innovation, although they had other good ideas that were poorly executed (eg, Pokemon Channel, Hey You, Pikachu!).
From: Cinnabar Island | Registered: Feb 2000
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Slade_64
chipmunk pr0n author
Member # 804
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posted 01-14-2007 04:47 AM
quote:
Originally posted by Mr. K:
I've completely agree with that. As you said, the first time it was fun and training (while repetitive) was something of a badge of honor, allowing you to bond with your Pokemon in a way that's impossible with a playing card...
I might have played one or two PBS games to completion, despite spending hours dicking around with the code. Other than the mall tours, I had only a handful of real battles, unless you count playing the computer in Stadium...
The original Pokemon universe is really terrific source material which could be mined in so many interesting ways, but now that there are too many species with too many dongles to keep in your mind without making a career out of it, it's incredibly boring to me...
As funny as this sounds, this describes exactly why I liked the Pokemon games when they first came out. It was like playing a whole new type of game and really what I wanted to see from the sequels was a 3D version of the game.
That’s why Pokemon Coliseum raised my interest when it came out. Unfortunately by the time it was released though, my interest in the game didn't surpass the demo I played at the stores. And as neat as XD looks, I'm too lazy to even rent it.
But game concept itself is still what interests me, and is what draws me to other games today. Since my pokemon days, my interests have shifted to more "grown-up" toys like cars. So I enjoy the Need for Speed Underground/Most Wanted/Carbon series because it retains similar gameplay as pokemon, but with cars. Collecting cars, "leveling" them up, and "battling" others by racing. Main difference though from your conventional RPG, I don't have to constantly battle (or race in this aspect) to make a better car. I can just purchase the parts and tune it to make it faster.
Now hitting on what lark said, leveling up and the exploration really did make it feel like an investment and that the results were somewhat gratifying. No matter how many times they change Pokemon now, I don't think it would be able to recreate that feeling of pride I once had of finally having a team of lvl 100 monsters. That and it's not exactly appealing to the mass public, whereas with NFS, I'm playing with cool cars that both my friends and chick can appreciate.
I don't think there would be any chicks coming up to me saying, "That's one hot Charizard you have there"...
[ 01-14-2007, 04:50 AM: Message edited by: Slade_64 ]
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Bucket.
From: Funky Town Texas | Registered: Aug 2000
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Lark84
My skeleton is made of creamy nougat.
Member # 1186
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posted 01-14-2007 08:31 AM
Mr. K: without making a career out of it
Exactly. "Pokémon trainer" is not really what I want to call my profession, yet it feels like that is exactly what would be required in order to master the new games. (but I won't deny that 7 years ago, I probably would have considered that a viable career option...)
Well, I guess I'll stop saying the same thing over and over again now, but as you probably can tell by my activity in this thread, I feel somewhat strongly about this topic.
I guess that due to the strong commitment and devotion I felt for Pokémon back in the day, I feel disappointed that the legacy of RBY and the world it introduced is being managed so poorly. I would really like it if a new Pokémon game or anime was released which I could enjoy, but I just don't see that happening.
This site and the care with which it has been crafted is testament to the devotion and love for the earliest installments in the Pokémon franchise, a love which transcends that of mere battle scores, stat lists or grayscale Pokémon bitmaps. We lived Pokémon, dreamed Pokémon, existed Pokémon.
To directly answer The Great Dreamer's question, then, I think the reason that we are not playing Pokémon anymore is that we feel that the later games are vastly inferior in some ethereal respect to the first ones, and do not in any way merit the investment in time and effort they require.
Perhaps the battle is forever lost - living up to the original games may be an impossible task, because they were not mere games, they were a new, unfamiliar concept inducing a state of mind which forever struck a cord somewhere deep inside all of us, still resonating today, and that is no easy feat.
[edit] Added the preachy bit. I just couldn't resist.
[ 01-14-2007, 08:50 AM: Message edited by: Lark84 ]
Registered: Nov 2000
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The Great Dreamer
Farting Nudist
Member # 117
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posted 01-14-2007 02:57 PM
I would think that the spin-off games would give all of you story-fans enough fuel for the fire to keep it burning. I am surprised to NOT read any praise towards the Ranger and Mistery Dungeon variants.
Now, let me write with some perspective here;
I am 30 years old and I work 50 hours a week plus I go to school part time.
It is with this background that I am admiting in having a new interest in pokemon as a game after what I awaited for so long is just around the corner: A pokemon game with online access out of the bat.
I have kept myself away from pokemon all these years and I have not even wanted to read up any FAQs or guides about the games and how it works for the exception of very few questions, the most important being: Is it possible to transfer pokemon from the GBC games to the GBA games and finally to the DS?
I don't want to know too much because I know that, in some ways, knowing too much about the game before you play it can really spoil the experience for you, it just tends to suck out all the wonder that it's in store for you. With this said, you don't have to have all level 100 pokemon and have a team that is at the level of tournament play where the sharkers frequent. You could have a small group of people that enjoy the game as much as you and play it for the joy of it, with competition being a secondary priority. Get together with a little brother or a cousin or a nephew and use pokemon as an excuse to spend quality time with them, or as I will do, wait for online so you can enjoy the game with others that also want to enjoy it casualy. You don't have to sacrifice hours from your life into the game, just play it sparringly just because you enjoy the experience and have the goals of the game and powerbuilding take a second seat.
I enjoy the game because of its inovative design and original concepts. I can say that I truly hate the anime and I hold it responsible for the stigma Pokemon has in society, forcing anyone who is 14+ straight into the closet or become a social pariah.
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"Pokemon, no matter what anyone says, is not just about link battles. PBS is not Pokemon." -Mr. K
From: Las Vegas were everyone uses Mimic & Metronome! | Registered: Mar 2000
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Rolken
Vulcan
Member # 7
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posted 01-15-2007 05:26 AM
quote:
Originally posted by The Great Dreamer:
I would think that the spin-off games would give all of you story-fans enough fuel for the fire to keep it burning. I am surprised to NOT read any praise towards the Ranger and Mistery Dungeon variants.
I believe the demand was specifically for *good* story; story that actually expanded the series in some meaningful way. I haven't played either beyond demo kiosks, but neither seemed to get a good reception and what I saw was unimpressive. Mystery Dungeon in particular was just a Pokemon rebranding.
quote:
Originally posted by The Great Dreamer:
Is it possible to transfer pokemon from the GBC games to the GBA games and finally to the DS?
Unfortunately, no; GBC and GBA can't communicate, though it's doubtful how useful pure RBY-era pokemon and moves would be in DP anyway.
quote:
Originally posted by The Great Dreamer:
I can say that I truly hate the anime and I hold it responsible for the stigma Pokemon has in society, forcing anyone who is 14+ straight into the closet or become a social pariah.
Eh. Considering that it's a game about collecting cute furry animals, it was probably doomed from the start; though no doubt the anime didn't help.
From: Provo, UT | Registered: Feb 2000
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Wintermute
My custom title sucks.
Member # 5
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posted 01-15-2007 10:42 AM
quote:
Originally posted by Dragonite21:
"Gotta catch 'em all! All 6051!"
Exactly. The strategy and story elements were both secondary for me. How many games had we played before that had an ecology? It was the magic of RBY, and nurtured the research endeavor. It was also a strength of the early anime, come to think of it.
Somehow adding an extra 100 turned the magic into homework. I'd much rather that they doled out 10 or 20 new pokemon at a time and emphasized new modes of gameplay and interaction. There are so many ways you can riff on the originals, Snap being a great example.
Maybe I just got too attached.
From: Winnipeg, Manitoba | Registered: Feb 2000
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Face
I invented cancer.
Member # 1916
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posted 01-15-2007 01:45 PM
The current state of azure is all thanks to senor k gg k
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Weezing!
From: Hackensack, nj | Registered: Jun 2001
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Anxious Clock
President Taft
Member # 1159
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posted 01-16-2007 06:49 PM
The thing that drew me into Pokemon was that I had never played a game quite like it. It was magical for a good bit, but I put it down in favor of other things years back. A friend of mine is playing Yellow right now and that got me looking at my old Red and Blue save files and somewhat rekindled the interest.
quote:
Originally posted by JohtoMaster:
quote:
Originally posted by ieR2:
Is the new game wifi compatible?
Yes. Both trading and battling.
Here's a retard question for you that doesn't have much to do with what you were talking about. If I bought FireRed/LeafGreen and played it on DS, would I need the DS Wi-Fi thing to battle a friend, or would the GBA Wireless Adapter somehow work just fine?
[ 01-16-2007, 06:50 PM: Message edited by: Anxious Clock ]
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Mr. K: omg nintendolover that shiz iz nawt k00l i m gonna bann j00 fuxx0rz!!!11!! - Mr. K to Nintendolover
From: Hell | Registered: Nov 2000
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Rolken
Vulcan
Member # 7
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posted 01-16-2007 07:42 PM
I think you'd be screwed. There's no link port and it can't use DS-only functions.
From: Provo, UT | Registered: Feb 2000
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The Great Dreamer
Farting Nudist
Member # 117
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posted 01-18-2007 04:25 PM
Personally, I will be getting the DS Pokemon version and I hope that alot of my old school friends, and rivals, do as well only because of the possibility of online out of the box via WiFi. Shoot, you could go to a library or a cofe shop and use their WiFi or get your own setup at home or just use your computer-illiterate neighbor's WiFi.
I already bough Emerald just so i can start to build up some coherent foundation for the future games. I kept myself from reading any FAQs or guides in order to preserve the wonder i once felt with the original series and I am glad to report that it is working. I am not going to wait to finish the game this time around in order to start looking for pokemon with good genes, I am doing it as I go along by filling my boxes with whatever I feel like capturing at the moment, you know? For a lark. Then, when all the boxes are full, I keep the pokemon that seem to have the better genes and let the others go and start to catch some more.
I am now playing pokemon almost everywhere I can, leaving the monotonous parts for when i watch TV or go to work, this way I don't get bored with the dull, but necessary, parts of the game.
Let's get ourselves up so we can show these new bloods that old school can indeed teach new school a lesson in respect.
I really hope the lot of you follow through, I've been waiting for this sort of thing for a very long time.
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"Pokemon, no matter what anyone says, is not just about link battles. PBS is not Pokemon." -Mr. K
From: Las Vegas were everyone uses Mimic & Metronome! | Registered: Mar 2000
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ieR2
Farting Nudist
Member # 3934
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posted 01-18-2007 05:28 PM
No no no, I think Azure died when K stopped letting people post links to goatse.cx and banned anyone who posted hentai/porn.
You know what needs to be done, and I LIKE FLOWERSwho weARE REDmust killFLOWERS ARE PRETTY.
[ 01-18-2007, 05:29 PM: Message edited by: ieR2 ]
From: CA | Registered: Jul 2006
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Anthrax
Ultimate Authoritative Power in the Universe
Member # 335
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posted 01-19-2007 07:57 PM
a couple months ago i was watching the show and it had some pokemon i had never seen or heard about before. so i went and checked and it was apparently introduced in ruby/sapphire/emerald.
ive had sapphire since it came out.
pokemon isnt the same anymore.
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She told The Associated Press she first realized her son was mentally ill in 1996 when he killed her oldest child, a 25-year-old woman who suffered from cerebral palsy, by beating her with a dumbbell.
From: Somebody put shit in my pants! | Registered: Apr 2000
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Uiru
Sketch Molester
Member # 437
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posted 01-26-2007 08:36 AM
quote:
Originally posted by The Great Dreamer:
Awaken, ancient lords of pokemon research and battle!
*grumble, roll over*
If it makes you feel better, I've been losing sleep lately trying to hack info out of DP. I'm tired of our very limited options for information.
~Uiru
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TIDUDSOFIEIHUGHEXXXC: "maybe he will let you touch his blow up do"
AFRO NOOOOOOO!!!
From: the floating castle of Newfoundland | Registered: May 2000
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Jackdaw
Farting Nudist
Member # 118
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posted 01-27-2007 11:12 PM
I never really... got past... Crystal... so there'd be a lot of work to be done. BUT, should the call came to old-school it up, I'd answer.
... I'd suck horribly at it, granted, but it's the effort that counts, right? ... right?
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~ Your avian friend, Jackdaw
PS: Yeah, yeah, yeah...
From: OH | Registered: Mar 2000
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Slade_64
chipmunk pr0n author
Member # 804
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posted 01-28-2007 06:25 PM
^^ditto^^
I've been meaning to get my hands on a DS anyway so I may check it out. Though I wouldn't be much help as far a researching goes.
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Bucket.
From: Funky Town Texas | Registered: Aug 2000
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