I can't even stand that they used Azure posts against you.

That's kinda sick.

But I've gone into that before.

One question I'm still not certain of: who pointed them to Azure? Hoppip seems to be getting the blame for that, but I don't recall him admitting to anything of the sort.

How were you associated with your online personality?

Wacked.

I still want Mr. K's opinion on all this, but I suspect he's away from the site for the three day weekend (I wouldn't have been in Gainesville but for some planning oddities, and likely wouldn't have posted much).

Were they clued in by max stats monsters? Six max stats monsters is plain sketchy, to be honest, though not outright illegal. (I posted in Sakaki tower about this issue: basically it's a "don't get caught" article)

Hoppip: I'm sorry that everyone is lunging into you with such venom, especially if all you did was make a casual comment. Iyse's first post wasn't extremely clear on what happened, and, truth be told, I'm still a little in the dark.

However, I can't agree with you on the Gameshark issue at all. Why do you hate Gamesharks? As a hardcore videogame loon myself, the only reason I could see for an intelligent person to hate legal shark use and pokémon (aka no illegal movesets or stats) would be because it gives them both an unfair advantage (impossible to have a team of max stats monsters naturally, or very nearly so) and because it cheapens the amount of time others spend playing the game.

Well, the first point may be vaild. While pokémon is in many ways designed for max stats at tournament play, and gamesharks help this out a lot, I can see the point.

I don't quite agree with it wholeheartedly however: please remember that the very fact that Nintendo made it possible to get max stats means that they intended it to happen. Also, pokémon sold in the millions. Each cartridge has probably an average of one hundred monsters. 1/65536 of them are max stats. That's a lot of genetically perfect, natural monsters distributed throughout the world.

The second point I don't just disagree with: it has no merit. Just like you, I like trained monsters better than sharked ones. I train when I can, and shark the rest. Play time does not equate with skill, especially time spent levelling monsters. It's a neat idea, but it just isn't right. The fun I get out of levelling a monster is personal. I don't feel remotely justified insisting that my opponents (or indeed the entire field of pokémon players) feel the same way.

Simply put: Despite the original intent, the versus mode is *entirely* seperate from the RPG mode. Many got tired of levelling monsters real quick, but fell in love with the strategy and second guessing of the multiplayer game.

Let's cut to the core: Originally the concept was that you do work (level monsters) for reward (better performance in fights). This is valid in normal RPGs, where you level up and take bad guys down. In multiplayer it becomes a game of "I can spend more time on the game then you", because the reward is that much more appealing (beating people at matches).

To prove that this was the original intent, look at the FFA mode. Clearly this is dominated by 6 Mewtwos at level 100. However, if you don't have the resources to do this (especially given how very long it takes to level up to 100: the in game monsters quit around the 50s but the scale stays exponential) the game becomes more of "who has better monsters?".

Gameshark takes this link between "Being Big Time Wasting Dork" and "Winning Games" and breaks it.

Of course, it's still fun to be a big time wasting dork, as I can personally attest to. But I will ask you to consider my point: that the versus mode performance stands alone, and that the manner of origin of the game pieces used doesn't matter towards the outcome.

Of course we like to attribute personalities to the monsters and get to know them over levels. But that doesn't mean we should *demand* that in our opponents, nor does it mean that should be the only way we do things.

Opinions welcome.

-cfalcon

I don't know what war story you're talking about, but if I deleted it, it didn't have anything to do with this particular thread.

And that the sentence ... was put there aswell to clarify you had no part in this.

The forum disclaimer is something I've been meaning to add for some time. This latest round of idiocy just reminded me that I ought to do it. We weren't in violation of University policy or any legitimate law beforehand and we aren't now.

The only edits I made in the original posting in this thread were the removal of full names, and the removal of the threat. The threat was obviously not for real, and only a moron would interpret it as such, but the world is full of morons, so we have to be careful.

Have you taken Azure off the pokemon top 50?

Yeah. Their server was still often very slow to respond, and we had been hanging pretty steady at #100 for a long time, so it wasn't even interesting from a curiosity standpoint.

Also, given the recent increase in irritating activity around here, I'm not really dying to bring in any more users.

I have mixed feelings.

First of all, anyone who directed people to this site as "proof" of sharking is a rat and a weasel and deserves to be called names.

And any official Nintendo reps who disqualified someone based on suspicion of sharking also deserve to have rotting produce thrown at them.

However, anyone using sharked, totally maxed-out Pokemon in a tournament is also a scumbag in my book.

This is all just vermin vs. vermin in my opinion. I don't care who did what to who.

Now, if the player only had max HP (ie, he sharked "responsibly"), I have no problem with that.

My personal feeling is that the Nintendo reps should be the only people with sharked, maxed-out Pokemon. Fighting the reps should be somewhat unfair. These guys should be better than great, and if they need to cheat to make it more meaningful when someone kicks their ass, that's cool with me.

On the whole, if this makes people think twice before maxing out their team with a cheating device before a tournament, I think that's great. However, barring any reasonable means of telling if a Pokemon has been sharked, Nintendo should not disqualify people based on hearsay.

...however, I can't say I'm not happy that someone was made an example of. I'm sorry it happened the way it did, but even tho it looks like Philbo might not have deserved it, I'll bet there are a lot of us who are happy that at least someone had to pay the price...

That be my rule!

rest - I've only been able to scan, and I have difficulty reading heavy swearing/angry text so I haven't been able to keep track 100%. At the championships, when Darren approached me, he made the first mention of disqualification, and he left out ANYTHING AND EVERYTHING to do with the industrial revoloution, which is pretty lazy. All I asked is if they were checked. I wrote a reply to Darrens post for a laugh (no offence, but it was clearly meant as name calling/animosity no?) but I must've pratted up, its a no show.

And to defend my companions honour - it seems he was acting in his conversation with Iyse, that is, just kidding he didn't know this from that. Apparently he feighned shock and just said yeah, whatever. Thought that was odd. As he has a very old DV description on his pin board. And it tells you what stab is in the game.

quote:

---

Originally posted by Iyse:
Does it also say that Charizard is the best?

---

YEah!! Charrizard rox man! AnD blasToise 2! And venusaur can Kick meWTWo's arse!1 whut u talking about?!?! Youi'll say dat pikaachuu is wubbISh necst!

Heh, sorry. Couldn't resist.

------------------
Gundam Wing/Thundercats: WHAT'S THAT?!? Sword of Omens, give me sight beyond sight. I'm going to fight it. Thunder...thunder...Thundercats...(buster rifle to the head).

Anyway, that figure might be unreasonable, considering that trainers take lots of time trying to get that perfect-gene PKMN. Even if they tried 100000 times, the odds will still be 1 in 7.92*10^23 that they get 6 perfect-gene PKMN. Therefore, it is stupid to say that someone can supposedly get a max-stat team the old-fashioned way, because it is near-impossible.

Anyway, my input on using GS to boost your PKMN? I say it's a fair way to compete in tournaments - instead of one person having a much better PKMN than all the rest, all of that type of PKMN at least have the same stats, making the game more FAIR to the people that use GS, but more UNFAIR to the people that train normally. Since using the GS drastically reduces your chance of losing a match against a non-GSed team, and making it fair and even against another GSed team, it's only up to the movesets and strategy that people will use. No one will be able to say "I got very lucky and picked up this max-stat PKMN which can beat the rest of your PKMN" A couple of speed points or special points or HP in a tournie _CAN_ make all the difference. By using the GS, you destroy the luck element in the game of catching wild PKMN. Which makes it all the more FAIR.

I use a GSed team, mainly because of those reasons. If someone beats my GSed team consistently with their GSed team, then that person is truly a better trainer than me, not because he got lucky and had better stats than my team. In conclusion - GS is a fair way of serious people competing in tournaments.

1. I've got 1 (ONE) max stat Pokémon, and it's my Jolteon.

2. You know what the odds of catching a Pokémon with DVs of 0, 0, 0, 0, 0? 65536 to 1!

3. Guess what the odds of catching a Pokémon of DVs 7, 7, 7, 7, 7. 65536 to 1!

4. I wonder what the odds are of catching a Pokémon with DVs 1, 7, 2, 5, 9. 65536 to 1!

Uhhhh... See a pattern emerging here? It's all the same!

And it's not 65536^6. It's 65536 x 6, coz it's a separate Pokémon.

(1)- A few points of speed and hit points can *easily* make the difference in a tournament. Odds of a monster having max speed: 1/16. Odds of a monster having max hit points: 1/16. Odds of a monster having both max speed and hitpoints: 1/128 (they are not independent variables).

All of my tournament level monsters have at least one or two max stats: else is stupid. All of the "fast" monsters have max speed. Come on, this is common sense and doesn't take to long.

For example, I went looking for a Mewtwo with max special, speed, and hit points (the odds of this are only 1/1024), and I was willing to accept one less in special: this increased my odds to 1/512. I was lucky enough to hit it on try 20 something.

(2)- By many forms of logic, cloning monsters is ok. Notably because both (a) Nintendo has published how to and (b) It is a game glitch resulting from the timing during trading. So once someone has a max stat monster, it can spread, and this isn't cheating.

(3)- The odds of getting a whole team of max stat monsters are phenomenal, especially if you try it *once*. Then you take two to the 16*6 (number of total bits you need to wind up being 1). But that isn't accurate. What you really do is go until you have the first one 1/65536, then go again for another one. I've already gone into average time taken in another post, and while the time taken is ridiculous, it doesn't require astronomical time. Note that it is still pretty indicitive of cheating that a team is max stat: the time is just too intense, and remember, it isn't guaranteed. You could catch monsters till your protons decay and not have six perfect ones.

Umm, no. It's 65536^6, because there's 96 bits that all have to be set to 1. 2^96 equals 65536^6 equals 7.92 x 10^28.

An example that someone (cfalcon?) used several months ago was that if every star in the universe had an orbiting plant with 8 million Pokemon players, you could expect that 10 of them would catch six max-stat Pokemon on their first try. ("But no, nothing is impossible.")

My point then was that the odds are absurd for getting a bunch right off the bat: but I'm trying to get everyone to remember that those aren't the only odds that matter.

Presumably, you don't catch six monsters and then ditch them all if they aren't all max stats: you catch one and ditch it if it isn't max stats. This really does make a difference, though the time taken is still ridiculous.

I believe the example you refers to goes to a million pokémon players on some number of inhabited planets orbitting every star in the universe, and finding that only 10 or so of them end up with 6 max statters on their first try. That's vaild: it's impossible.

Ok, here we go:

Let's assume you have to catch an average of 65536 monsters (keep in mind it could *never* happen) to get a max stat one. Great. Let's suppose it takes you only 40000 tries. That's good! Now, let's try to do it again. This time you get less lucky and it takes you 80000. If you had been trying to catch both at once it would have taken an average of 4294967296 tries, but here it only took 120000 tries (average value would be 131072). My point is that since you can break it down into chunks it is possible to do it in human time... just not in reasonable time.

If it takes you 30 seconds to process a monster (and that's generous), that would be 120,000 / 2 = 60,000 minutes = 10,000 hours. So if you played 10 hours A DAY then it would take you about 2 years of that to get two max stat monsters.

Keep in mind that if you copy monsters from other max statters, this goes out the window: that's a fair way to get them, and maybe we'll be able to trade over the internet some day. I think there have been more than 6 natural max stat monsters on this very board, in total...

But no one caught six in a row. The odds of that are on par with running into a wall and praying for mass quantum tunneling...

------------------
-cfalcon

But still, no one cares about you Darth!

Oh and Iyse cream, if you have no faith in me, fine, don't join my religous following. If your reffering to what I said: Theres a trainer in the fencey bit at the top of some town (I'll get the name if you want me to, nice guy that I am) that says something like, pokemon that use attacks of the same type gain more power or something, thus telling you about stab in the game.

Ok, thus ends my lecture...for now!

fiss - I had a feeling you were scottish. Yeah, I got some lolipops, ripped up magazines, cheap merchandise and a cd I was earlier accused of stealing. From the man who was giving them out for free. They scuppered my evil plan. And yeah, mon the celts. PBS battle sometime?

quote:

---

Originally posted by Darth David:
Oh and Iyse cream,

---

Oh yeah, coz that's new!

quote:

---

if you have no faith in me, fine, don't join my religous following. If your reffering to what I said: Theres a trainer in the fencey bit at the top of some town (I'll get the name if you want me to, nice guy that I am) that says something like, pokemon that use attacks of the same type gain more power or something, thus telling you about stab in the game.

---

I don't care 'bout you little conflicts with me. You boasting that your friend/brother/cousin whatever, knew a lot more than myself, or AH or something like that. He obviously didn't, and we are taking the piss out of you because you're acting like an amateur/newbie. You come to AH, you act like an Azurian.

And I don't hold anything else against you, apart from the fact that your miserable attempts to explain why he pretended to know nothing make a few people a bit ticked off. Most will find it amusing to some extent, such as me! =D

You tell me to act like an Azurian, well look at my actions. I was mid way through a meal when I was helping Philbo at the hotel, that portrays one person. What others say about me portrays another. If you're going to judge me by actions, judge by my actions. You insult me and I don't insult you back, like when Stampy rams the other elephants in the Simpsons, does this make me a jerk?

I don't have any conflict with House Special Fried Iyse, nor anyone here.

I didn't mean to infer my friend knew more than AH, simply more than you were giving him credit for. Y'know all that morning in the lobby we were getting pumped for information, I'm not the only one that decided to play dumb. There were some people that feigned blank expressions at the mention of Stat EXP or removing MissingNo. I can't give a good excuse, because I can't prove either way, not that it really matters. I wanted to defend my friend who isn't in this board and was getting insulted. When I said that he knew stuff Azure didn't or something, I meant there was stuff in the web site hes writing that isn't in Azure *****BUT theres probably stuff in Azure he doesn't know about either!*****

1. I'm not insulting you
2. I'm not insulting your friend
3. If it ain't on Azure, it's probably on Darryn's site.

=P

You've missed out on a couple of points that I think maybe I should clarify for you. Bear in mind that this reply does not in any way express the views or opinions of Nintendo, or of THE Games Ltd.
It's simply a reply to some of the comments you and certain other Azurians have posted recently. Now that's all of the diclaimers over and done with, lets get on with it.

1. There was no malice involved in checking your, or anyone elses', cartridge at the events, be they the Championships themselves or at the Finals. I checked at least 50 games during the Championships at the request of other players who suspected their opponents had been cheating (whether by GS, Xploders, or other means). In every case, I was both impartial, and as fair as possible. As many have pointed out, checking cartridges for sharked pokemon or other cheats (which was, incidently, point 3 of the rule sheet sent out to every entrant) is pretty damn hard, but I have to check the carts if I'm asked. I don't think you guys were particularly singled out, and it certainly wasn't the first time I had checked entrants cartridges.

2. I stand by my comments that the site is a good one. You ARE (mostly) all good trainers, and that point is not one I would debate. The whole point of checking cartridges was to try and ensure that all the entrants were playing by the rules. In any competition, there are rules to abide by. Some people get off on trying to get around the rules, and the rules clearly stated that we would not allow the use of any pokemon that had been altered or enhanced by the use of cheat devices. No-one is denying that you are a good trainer. However, if you don't want to play by the rules, don't enter the competitions. As I told you at the Dome, the competitions are organized so that everyone can enter. Most people won't have the same understanding of the game that you or I do. But that shouldn't prevent them from entering. The rules are there to protect them from thinking that the only way they can win is by cheating, or being a member of an 'elite' clique, instead of hard work and dilligence. So take comfort in the knowlege that you are an experienced player, and don't slam them for being green. Everyone starts somewhere.

3. As to the matter of who informed me initially of the site, that is something that you Azurians will have to sort out for yourselves. The vitriolic replies that a lot of people seem to be posting are largely unfounded and ill-informed slagging. Speculation can be a dangerous thing. However, you guys should be intelligent enough to forgive and forget. There's no Big Brother conspiracy going on with regard to my reading the site. It's my job to stay informed as to the current trends in the videogame industry, but it's also a matter of personal interest. I'm certainly not scanning the posts for evidence of cheating - personally, I agree with a lot of the comments regarding the use of GS on this particular post. But if I'm approached in a professional capacity, I have to check these things out.

Many auzurians have stated that they believe max statted pkmon to be a fair way of competing - and indeed it is, if the other entrants have all had the opportunity to do the same. I don't think that nintendo had it mind to exclude any competitors. The odds against catching 6 max statted pkmon _are_ astronomical, but that's not to say it couldn't happen, or that the entrants got them in a fair trade (although who would do that is anyones guess). To my knowlege, none of the azurians were disqualified due to being suspected of having sharked their teams. We did contact some of them and explain that by using sharked teams they were breaking the rules, but we still let them enter, because there is simply no way to check how exactly they came by their pkmon, unless you actually catch them doing it. But hey, that's not what the tourny was about anyway. It was supposed to be fun, not only for the 'casual' gamers, but for you guys too.

Philbo - you sound bitter about the whole thing. Your point about the murder suspect is a bit far fetched. As I mentioned before, I checked your game because I was asked to by a third party, not because I was aching to disqualify someone.

So, just to clear this up - no one was disqualified on simple suspicion of cheating. No one. Any disqualifications that were made during the whole of the event were, in my opinion, entirely impartial. More to the point, the rules that every entrant was sent with their confirmation reply clearly stated that disqualification was a possibility if the rules themselves were not abided by.

I'm sure that every azurian out there will have mixed feelilng regarding this post. Whether or not this has done anything to alleviate the obviously bad feelings about the tour is anyones guess, but I hope so. This is all supposed to be fun, after all. It's only a game.

I am ashamed of the way I behaved, yes, it's the old: You were right, I was wrong fiasco...

Everything you have said is true, but I don't even use a shark, so I'm not in on this thing anywayz.

Your friends (or colleages, the two of which are very different =D), said you had the nickname: "Skivey Boy", so I thought that might be a little inner joke I could have on.

Also, why do you like piercings so much? No offence, but you did look like a Frankenstein familiar with those bolts in your neck. =D

Ahhh well... Next year next year will be Azure year. And I for one will be many who won't be cheating. 0=)

Let's list the big UK names, shall we?

Me =D
Darryn
Philbo
Ryoga
branners
Hitmonrich (=D, one of the forgotten ones.)

Um..... I'm sorry, fill me in on some more big UK names around Azure...

Anyway, I'm hungry, and I have GCSE coursework to do =D, later.

And I'm not bitter, Darryn is gonna kick ass at the world championships, and I wish him all the luck in the world, I even said that on stage....

And BTW, your piercings rock!

Come on, this thing's still being discussed a fortnight later! Don't forget who was responsible in the first place! Me!

I just wanna be a famous guy from the UK, that's all. Please? Guys?

Oh yeah, to everyone, Hoppip is actually really cool in real life ^_^

------------------
-branners, AKA Tominater

Viva La Iyse!
Viva la Darryn!
Yes, even Viva La Philbo!

VIVA LA AZURE!

WE'LL CRUSH 'EM THIS TIME!

------------------
Responsible for the huge UK Tournament Fiasco
Firm beliver in magic
PKA the Egyptian god of death, changed name to the cute flying tomato prior to the Bristol tournament
Pathological hater of Missingno and Gamesharks
Still funky after 15 years

The piercings, for those who are interested, are all done by a good friend of mine who runs a piercing studio where my flatmate works. Yes, they hurt.But damn are they fun!

Darren - have a good time in Sydney. As for the rest of you, no doubt I'll see you next time...

I think that says everything.

Nice to see you here, Scarab. Sounds like you've got a good sense of perspective about the whole thing.

quote:

---

Originally posted by Scarab:
Hopefully next year will be even better..?

---

what? there's going to be one next year? is it red and blue again?

(start)---

Gah, Graeme, it's Darryn

BTW, what's with "congratulations" ?

It was fun, yeah, and next year shall definitely be better ^_^
*must retain title*

No, I expect to lose next year, to branners of course

Depends....if it's a G/S tourney somehow he's never gonna win ^_^; (branners note: no =P)

next stop : Sydney.....

-----(end)

Now, just gotta make every poke legal for the GS tourney. Oh, and make them 6 man battles ^_^

------------------
-branners, AKA Tominater

sorry, Darryn, I should've checked the spelling...

Dragonite21: Yeah, there should be one next year, but (and remember, this ain't The Big N saying this) it'll probably be for R/B/Y/G/S, and be using Stadium 3 (which is looking pretty damn special, and will hopefully clear up some of those *ahem* quirky bits in Stadium...

We're still busy clearing the European release of G/S, so no news on the next tour as yet, but I'll try and keep you all posted as to new developments, if you're interested.

Philbo - Yeah, I've got ICQ, but I'm never on earlier than 3am. Gotta talk to my buddies in Japan, so I tend to steer clear of other users. My email at work is GraemePuttock@Nintendo.TheGames.co.uk

Mr K - Thanks for the comments and the welcome. As I said, I'm not on this site to check up on anyone. It's a good 'un, and it's a personal interest, so cheers.

A R/B/Y/G/S tour...

Let's rearrange them...

RGBYS tour

A Rugbys tour, =D yay!

o well.. ill just shut up...

I suppose the UK is mostly to blame!

Damn!! Can you imagine if this game had never been made!??!!

quote:

---

Originally posted by 10,000Lb.Snorlax:
Damn!! Can you imagine if this game had never been made!??!!

---

AHHHHH!!!! Don't say that!!!! =**(

quote:

---

Originally posted by 10,000Lb.Snorlax:
Damn!! Can you imagine if this game had never been made!??!!

---

Scary. What else would I have spent 500+ hours of my life on?

------------------
-Dragonite21

I HAVEN'T USED A CHEAT DEVICE.

That in everyone's heads? Good.

quote:

---

Originally Posted by Philbo
Darryn’s 2nd battle

This guy looked terrible

---

*was the terrible guy

>_<

Venusaur...Blastoise...
*shudder*

I am also a bit afraid of going to a tour in Sweden. If I win (which I think I will, at least some of the battles) people will soon start to accuse me of cheating, since my pokémon are stronger than theirs. How am I supposed to explain the box trick, DV's etc to people who doesn't even know about STAB? And they'll see the box trick as cheating, I am 101% sure of that.

quote:

---

Originally posted by Iyse:
A Rugbys tour, =D yay!

---