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Author Topic: Have the rules for Critical Hits changed again?
Porcupine
Farting Nudist
Member # 46

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posted 04-16-2004 04:19 PM      Profile for Porcupine   Email Porcupine   Send New Private Message      Edit/Delete Post  Reply With Quote 
I've never played R/S competitively before, so I'm not sure. GameFAQs has NOTHING on this subject anywhere, which just goes to show how lousy their FAQs are for Pokemon. I could test this myself (and I will if no one answers) but hopefully someone else already knows the answer. People who battle competitively should know I think.

How do Critical Hits work when stat modifiers are in place? This changed from Red/Blue to Gold/Silver, and I'm wondering if it changed again in Ruby/Sapphire.

Here is what I know for sure. In Red/Blue, Critical Hits multiplied your Level by 2, effectively dealing about double damage. Any stat modifiers (Amnesia, Swords Dance, etc) on EITHER the attacking or defending pokemon are ignored completely. So a fully Swords Danced pokemon attacking a unboosted pokemon, would actually do less damage with a critical hit.

In Gold/Silver, this was changed. The damage is still doubled by the same formula. However, the damage doubling works with any positive stat boosts your own Pokemon has. So a Swords Danced pokemon attacking a unboosted pokemon would do 4x damage with a critical hit. However, critical hits still penetrated the defender's stat boosts (Amnesia, Barrier) as before.

In Ruby/Sapphire, everything I said above for Gold/Silver still applies.

What I'm not sure of is exactly what happens when a boosted pokemon attacked a boosted defending pokemon, and scores a critical hit. I *believe*, though I can't remember and am not sure, that in Gold/Silver, whatever damage advantage you have (Attacking Boost Modifier divided by Defending Boost Modifier) remained unchanged if it was greater than 1, but was set to 1 if it was less than 1. Then the double damage critical hit was applied over this.

In Ruby/Sapphire, I'm not sure either but I've taken more damage than I expected from a few hits against some Colosseum pokemon. I suspect maybe the rules regarding this were changed *again*, and now a critical hit is simply your Attacking Boost Modifier times 2 (for the critical)...ignoring the Defending modifiers completely.

Does anyone have full knowledge of how the system works, for Gold and Ruby?

From: Honolulu, HI, USA | Registered: Feb 2000  |  IP: Logged
White Cat
Nobody knows why I'm an admin.
Member # 42

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posted 04-17-2004 04:56 AM      Profile for White Cat   Author's Homepage   Email White Cat      Edit/Delete Post  Reply With Quote 
In GSC, either all of the stat modifiers on both Pokemon were used or none of them were, depending on which way did more damage. Modifiers like Light Screen/Reflect and weather effects are always used, however.

http://www.angelfire.com/pa4/jman/critical_hits.html

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From: Calgary | Registered: Feb 2000  |  IP: Logged
Continue
Farting Nudist
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posted 04-17-2004 12:32 PM      Profile for Continue   Email Continue   Send New Private Message      Edit/Delete Post  Reply With Quote 
And, yeah, CHs changed again for R/S. It has been posted about here before. There has been reason to be hesitant about using the search function here before, but it did work for this:
http://www.math.miami.edu/~jam/azure/forum/tuff/ultimatebb.php?ub b=get_topic;f=1;t=001333

As for Colosseum, I haven't been able to do anything pokemon-related for over a month, so I can't be sure, but the Stadium games have followed the general behavior for CHs in their game series (individual CH-affecting moves may not, however). Based on that, I would assume that CHs in Colosseum are the same as in R/S.

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From: Boca Raton, FL | Registered: Feb 2000  |  IP: Logged
Porcupine
Farting Nudist
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posted 04-19-2004 06:53 PM      Profile for Porcupine   Email Porcupine   Send New Private Message      Edit/Delete Post  Reply With Quote 
Thanks, White Cat and Continue!

Wow, I was right on my suspicions in both Gold/Silver and Ruby/Sapphire... =) I'd worded it differently but essentially I had hypothesized exactly what your links gave me, for both games.

And after some forum searching I found out my other hypothesis was true...that the stat cap limit of 999 is gone.

Darn, this makes me mad! I don't like the way R/S plays out compared to R/B/Y/G/S/C. I don't play Pokemon competitively anymore (I only played PBS and GSbot) and don't plan to. Global changes with the EV system, Nature system, Abilities, and Critical Hit system have made the game way more offensive. In many ways this is a good thing, but I'm a fan of old school Red/Blue PP wasting, stalling, and Ice Beaming, so I'm sad to see how Pokemon has changed. PP wasting/Spiking was still useable in Gold/Silver...but now I think Ruby/Sapphire is all about offense, and nothing else.

The way Critical Hits work now, defensive moves like Barrier, Reflect, Cosmic Power, are totally worthless. Rest is worthless, even with Chesto Berry. Even Recover, which used to be the penultimate valuable move in the game, isn't too useful. When I see movesets for Pokemon who know Recover which don't even use the move, I am saddened. [Wink]

There's no point to sitting there and tanking up anymore in Ruby/Sapphire...the opponent merely needs to Swords Dance, Bulk Up, or Calm Mind to full power...then start attacking again and again. Eventually a Critical Hit will occur and OHKO the defending tank pokemon into atoms. Then the rest of the team is swept. Boo hoo. [Frown]

From: Honolulu, HI, USA | Registered: Feb 2000  |  IP: Logged


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